THE SAGA OF SUPERWALMART AT PEDA: TOO BIG TO SUCCEED?
BY DAN VALENTI
PLANET VALENTI NEWS AND COMMENTARY
(FORTRESS OF SOLITUDE, WEDNESDAY JULY 20, 2016) — One of the large projects that The Tyer Administration has adopted for its own is the relocation of the Berkshire Crossings’ Walmart to the PEDA site off Woodlawn Avenue, just over the bridge from East Street. There are many reasons in favor of this proposal and many against.
Today, to further educate citizens on the ramifications of Big Box development on municipal development, THE PLANET presents this guest article from the website strongtowns.org. In Part II tomorrow, we will provide the counterarguments or, if you prefer, the refutation.
THE PLANET asks that you weigh in on this topic with a simple “yes” (oui) or “no” (ja) to the equally simple question: Do you favor the Walmart move to PEDA or not? After your “oui” or “ja,” give us your reasons. Virtually every decision maker in town reads this site. This means your voice will be heard.
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BIG BOXES: TOO BIG TO SUCCEED?
BY CHARLES MARHON
strongtowns.org
SPECIAL TO PLANET VALENTI NEWS AND COMMENTARY
I’ve seen way too many cities fall for the big box store. In fact, I worked on a couple of them back in my engineering days. The big box retailer would come to town and promise to pay all the up-front costs for running the sewer and water and putting in the frontage roads. Sometimes they ask for tax subsidies to pay them back – “but for” the subsidy, the development wouldn’t happen, or so they say – but often they make this investment as part of doing business.
From the local government’s standpoint, this transaction is ideal. For little to no money down, the city gets all this additional investment, new jobs for the community, an increase in tax base and ongoing sales tax revenue. Pure genius (or so we tell ourselves). All we have to do in exchange for this windfall is take on the long term liability of providing service to the site. That bill won’t come due for decades – and accounting rules book these liabilities as assets anyway – and so it’s all good.
As we’ve looked at here in the past many times, these investments have very low productivity. They are losing investments once the public infrastructure runs more than one life cycle. The scenario I’ve described up to this point is the first step in the Growth Ponzi Scheme. If it ended there, the financial hit would be serious, but the tragedy would be modest.
This is rarely where it ends, however. In the great chase for more growth, cities use the big box investments to push further outward. It might not be obvious to the person driving by, but that new residential development up the road is upstream, so to speak, from the big box. That means their water and sewer service passes through that big box site. See the problem yet?
The dirty little secret of big box development – and it’s really not a secret – is that the buildings are designed to be abandoned. They are throw-away buildings with a shelf life of twelve to fifteen years. Now, do they occasionally last longer? Absolutely, when the retailer decides that location is worth maintaining and upgrading the building. Very often, however, the site is simply abandoned when the big box opens a new location a little further away, the old building boarded up or sold to some non-competing, much lower revenue entity.
The utilities aren’t abandoned, however. Nope; they now become the eternal obligation, because now they not only serve the abandoned site, but they are essential to providing service to those further upstream. Default on the maintenance promise at the big box site and the city defaults on everyone further out. It’s a dead site, but it continues to cost taxpayers large sums of money.
We’re pretty blind to this problem, as a culture and also as professionals working in related fields. We’ve been so amazingly affluent – or have been allowed to pretend we are – that all of this waste hasn’t mattered to us. We don’t do the math and instead just assume that new growth will save us as it has since we began the Suburban Experiment. As more and more cities find themselves with deep financial problems, we’re waking up to the reality that we can’t have miles of pipe in the ground that serve nothing productive. We can’t throw away money like that anymore.
This all serves to illuminate the fact that big box development is extremely risky. We, the taxpayers, put a pipe in the ground in our name and we’ve made an eternal promise that generation after generation is expected to make good on. The big box retailer builds a store and they’ve recouped their capital costs in a decade. They are then free and clear to move on leaving us with a dead site.
Their zealous obligation is to their shareholders. I can respect that, but our obligation to our taxpayers – today’s and tomorrow’s – needs to be equally zealous.
This week we’re going to focus on big box stores. We’re going to look at their relatively low financial productivity combined with their high risk. We will examine sites that have failed and sites that have been reclaimed. We’ll delve a little into what is known as “sprawl retrofit” (their term, not mine) and take some time to look at the good and bad of urban big box stores. I also want to examine state subsidies for big box stores and how state governments have created – for their own financial benefit – a race to the bottom for municipalities.
Finally, we hope you will join us in collecting data from your city for a national database on financial productivity that we are assembling in coordination with our friends at Urban 3. You can find out more about that here.
I have long said that Strong Towns is not an anti-big box movement. America’s big box retailers are perfectly adapted to the rules of the game as we’ve collectively established them. If you don’t like the outcome of the game, don’t hate the participants. Change the rules.
SEE ALL OUR BIG BOX STORES ANALYSIS
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Join us for Part Two tomorrow: “BIG BOXES: WHEN IT’S ALL YOU’VE GOT, YOU GO FOR IT”
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“Economic development consists of who can give away the taxpayers’ money faster.” — Sir Tiberius Fruitjuice & Sloof Lirpa
“OPEN THE WINDOW, AUNT MILLIE.”
LOVE TO ALL.
The views expressed in the comment section or opinions published within the text other than those of PLANET VALENTI are not those of PLANET VALENTI or endorsed in any way by PLANET VALENTI; this website reserves the right to remove any comment which violates its Rules of Conduct, and it is not liable for the consequences of any posted comment as provided in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act and PLANET VALENTI’s terms of service.
Will the city be taking in more taxes after the move or less??? The taxpayers should not have to subsidize any more business . If it is less taxes I vote no. If it is more taxes I vote yes. And I mean from day one not 9 years like Mr corporate handout Stanley.
Mountain one…Stevenson insurance….Walmart….all 3 are just a change of address….no new jobs.
The 80 jobs will be cut in half 6 months after it opens
Really?
Yes, build the store.
This article doesn’t apply here. This isn’t sprawl. They are moving closer to town. The utilities already exist.
No one else will build on that site. It’s big box or nothing.
They should offer Walmart, the Pittsfield Resource Recovery Facility, operating as ( Vicon) Covanta parcel 5.8 acres instead. Still love how they changed the name to the Teens. Nothing makes any sense any more.
Ron, that parcel was always called the teens. Its where GE buildings 13-19 were located. Those buildings housed the medical center, labs, drafting, metal fab, the William Stanley Library and records.
If the pay is 15 an hour, yes…….Planet do you have the Consent Decree on hand? other than the in lieu of taxes ( that was for PEDA paychecks for Cory and Hines ) the only info we were told was what Gerry Coyle told us. Of all the info in the agreement, no mention of a safety net when it was determined the quality of jobs at the site, which would negate any low pay big box coming in? We were bamboozled with the agreement, just like the School Building needs. Both were stacked decks.
I get so sick of the poor treatment of Walmart and other box stores by progressives. Walmart is responsible for people being able to buy affordable quality items for a long time now. They do provide jobs that keep many people employed for a long time and a Super Walmart WILL need to hire more people and these positions will NOT be temporary. The one in North Adams is wildly successful from what I have seen. Big Y in Adams and the supermarket in North Adams are still in business despite there being a Super Walmart in that area. Please don’t tell me that the Price Chopper in Williamstown/North Adams closed. That was too far away to be competitive with the Super Walmart.
Many progressives are wealthy and can afford to shop in the elite little shops of Berkshire County where they think nothing of paying outrageous prices for similar items that the rest of us purchase at Walmart for far less money. I say we NEED a new super Walmart. If the suits were capable of bringing businesses into that area, they would have done so by now one would hope. Should it sit empty for another 20 or more years?
This is exactly the point I wanted to make Pat. I choose to buy fresh foods at the farmers’ market, use amazon prime, and buy few unnecessary items.
It does not mean that the people that rely on Wal-Mart or other “box stores” deserve disparaging comments. These people have limited time and resources The people that work there work there from necessity, not choice. dollar general in rural areas? Do you really want to drive 20 minutes because you need sugar or toothpaste? Convenience is not negative.
Remember when the conservatives were the ruling class and the rich. Please define what you think is a progressive Pat. While your at it tell us what a suit is. While waiting the vote is Oui because nothing else is going to go there.
Read “Animal Farm”. The progressives have turned into all the worst traits they associated with conservatives. They ignore the poor, do nothing for the poor, and only care about money and power. We are far from having equality. The gap between rich and poor has never been greater. That is a description of the modern progressive.
Since I live in North Adams and you clearly don’t Pat, let me correct many of your faulty claims with the actual facts. The North Adams Super Walmart as it was originally proposed was going to provide ‘over 100 full and part-time jobs, most full-time,’ it was going to provide ‘over $100,000 a year in new property taxes,’ it was ‘not going to impact on any existing stores.’ All of these ‘promises’ were made to the North Adams Planning Board and to Mayor Alcombright.
In the end, they hired fewer than 75 people, most were part time, and when the slow season hits, which is January through April, many of these people receive few if any hours. Their pay is low, far below $15 an hour cited by this group coming to Pittsfield, and they have few if any benefits. I know several Walmart workers, and they are not a happy lot and most have to work a second job.
The city was notified only months after opening that the new Walmart would take advantage of a tax loophole in Massachusetts that qualified Walmart for a much lower tax payment… they now pay around $38,000 a year… not ‘over $100,000’ to North Adams as the developers originally claimed would happen.
Greenberg’s, a large hardware store, closed because of Walmart, putting 30 people out of work, people who had worked there for decades. Price Chopper closed because of Walmart, putting over 50 people out of work, again many who worked there for decades. North Adams once had a downtown AT&T store, gone after Walmart opened, because Walmart was then an AT&T provider. Staples, which was doing good business in North Adams before Walmart opened, closed. McLelland’s Hallmark, closed. Several other niche stores in the downtown, closed.
On Price Chopper, you say it was ‘too far away to be impacted,’ wrong…Price Chopper served a predominantly lower income population living in the west end of the city. When Walmart opened, they offered vouchers for free bus rides to Curran Highway, and drew significant numbers of west end residents to their store. The per week sales at Price Chopper dropped dramatically when Walmart opened (a relative of mine was a manager there and told me the numbers). Stop & Shop was not impacted because it’s “Williamstown’s store.” Downtown Big Y was hurt initially, and still has lower sales per week than they did before Walmart, but they did recoup some of that when Price Chopper closed.
Keep your eyes closed and you will not see what a new Super Walmart will do to Pittsfield – but be warned – say goodbye to Harry’s, say goodbye to Price Rite, maybe even Aldi’s. More downtown stores will shutter, and many businesses along Tyler Street will close.
I have only been in a Super Walmart a couple of times but their food prices did not seem that cheap to me. and Price Chopper gouges the hell out of its customers. I think Price Rite and Aldis will be just fine.
Harry’s smells like mold, and there was no outrage when they closed the elm street store (how is that new Co-op HQ coming along?).
If super Walmart can operate with that many fewer people and still meet the needs of the community, then all of those other operations deserved to wither.
Shh is rude. Please redact
The wahconah street store is crummy, the equipment is old and it need serious investment.
If progressives knew how to actually bring jobs to this area and weren’t so anti-business, this area wouldn’t need to shut down for a slow season from January to April. There wouldn’t be a slow season that is dependent on tourists.
This area has been falling apart long before Super Walmart came to the area. You can’t blame all of those closures on a Super Walmart. Same with Pittsfield. We have so many closures in this area right now.
Pat can you recognize a progressive when you see one? Are there any living in your neighborhood? Do you cross the street when you see one coming? Are they the antichrist?
Do you have nightmares about them?
Oui.
This answer has changed over time. What I have decided was that GE never wanted this site built upon. But, after blogs like DV’s shed light on the black hole that is PEDA, it was decided something must go there.
The site is probably too toxic, utility costs in New England too high for manufacturing, and the industrial infrastructure (meaning skills) neglected for too long to expect anyone else to take this site on.
While many blame Doyle and Hickey, who honestly believes they added anything meaningful to the process nearly two decades ago? EPA and DEP made all the decisions and called all the shots, while those two merely nodded in agreement like two people overwhelmed they were allowed to sit at the adult table rather than the kids table at Thanksgiving.
Now that I’ve been beaten down – I will take it. My trust that the PEDA Board did anything to actively market or pursue decent jobs on that site was shattered long ago. The meetings, the press releases, and such were all window dressing to make me think something would happen. The Feds and State Government perpetuated a big lie. The truth being, GE was abandoning the site and it would never be productive again.
Our jobs went first down south, then to Mexico, and then to various parts of Asia. This country is being sold out by our leaders – and there is nothing any local official can do to stop that outbound flow of jobs or the inbound flow of heroin.
I think too many in this area partake of drugs (pot especially) that has impaired their ability to even think clearly. I’m not even talking about the hard drugs like heroin. That’s a whole other sad story.
It depends.
It depends on the design, and unfortunately the design Walmart presented recently is not right for the goals everyone is talking about (such as easy walking access to fresh food). Walmart intends to use their standard suburban store layout — the same design they would use in a corn field in the middle of nowhere. That’s dumb for this location. This location should have urban design that integrates with the Morningside neighborhood. That means the building must be right up next to Tyler Street and Woodlawn Ave. The parking should be off to the side or in back, away from Tyler Street. Right now they are planning to locate the store as far as possible from Tyler Street, with a huge parking lot in front. This isolates the store from the Morningside neighborhood. The good news is that Walmart can do better and they have in other cities (see article below). Councilors should make it clear that they will not approve this wrong-headed design but will consider an urban design.
http://greatergreaterwashington.org/post/14555/walmarts-6-dc-stores-some-will-be-urban-some-wont/
Mike Ward’s suggestion to build Walmart as close to Tyler/Woodlawn Aves. as possible makes total sense (for all the reasons he gave).
If PEDA and our City Council don’t agree with this suggestion, something is amiss.
I vote “oui”!
Mike Ward is spot on here. Based on current available information it does seem that there is limited ability to develop this site. If Wal Mart is one of the only options why not fight to make it the right kind of building. The building is likely to last longer than Wal Mart will.
My reasoning for having it closer to Woodlawn and Tyler is there was a lot of open space between there and where the proposed site is that wasn’t’ used and the GE Fire Dept. was in the corner. It’s probably the “cleanest” part of the property. No manufacturing was done there. All the bad stuff happened in the middle of the GE complex, way out of site.
Big Y often has to have a cop or security guard in the store to deal with the rampant theft from folk in that neighborhood. If Walmart moves to Morningside it might need its own police force and holding cells.
and the employees might need the Kevlar vests
Need extra space to tackle shoplifters, before they hit the streets.
The site development costs are completely different. While there may be subtle changes the company can make, Pittsfield does not generate enough $ales per square foot to substantiate that kind of design alteration. All you free market anti-progressives suddenly want to tell people what to do with their land and how to run their business.
Also, none of even noticed when Lee gave Big Y a huge tax abatement, even though that will eventually cause the Market 32 (recently declared by someone the worst supermarket in America) to shutter.
Yes.
1. The head of PEDA himself tells us (in this month’s BTC):
“There are great sites within the…business park that are ready for industrial development but the teens isn’t one of them. It may be the largest individual parcel in the park but it’s also the most complicated and problematic. If there were another proponent with a proposal we would certainly consider it. But the cost and amount of work that has to be done to the site is not something that most potential industrial users would be willing to take on. Waterstone is willing to make that investment now, at no cost to the city and taxpayers. We may not have that opportunity again.”
If this is the sentiment of the person in charge of selling this land, you can best believe they will not find another developer…
2. In regards to this article – name one empty big box development in Pittsfield that this article would pertain too. You can’t pick the West Housy plaza as that was filled with all locally owned small businesses….
Wasn’t the” West Housy” plaza originally anchored by The Big N . A Neisner owned division ( later acquired by Ames) that was formatted like a big box store ? Not all locally owned small businesses, but a big box store. Research it !
??? This must be way before my time. In that case, I’d argue it doesn’t count. How many big box stores are left anywhere 50 years later…?
I just remember the movie theatre, the restaurant, the furniture store, Champion outlet and the Goodwill…
You’re not thinking the Bradlees Plaza on Merrill Road are you?
Growing up as a kid in the 60’s, Dowager Hat is correct in saying Big N was there first and at the other end of the building where the furniture store was, there was a grocery store can’t remember the name of it…
I vote “oui”. Lots of good debate from both sides but for me it comes down to the reality that nothing else will ever be built there in terms of what they first promised–real manufacturing & real jobs. I do like what Mike Ward said about design, don’t put parking lot ocean in front. It will isolate the store from the Tyler-Dalton Ave., Morningside foot traffic.
My vote is no I just don’t think it’s a good idea. Mostly because the City has not made public what the burden for the city would be and alternately the taxpayer
What’s the cost to taxpayers?
What’s in this for Thurston?
Mike Wards very progressive thinking is very thoughtful but as a progressive he cant be right.Mike was also for a very progressive idea in the bike path idea….this is crazy stuff Mike.
Hopping on this idea put it on Tyler and have 4 sided front …even in the back you could camiflouge the back of the store where delivery services are .Just change the colors to denote the back of the building
Mikes idea just generates discussion away from the real question. Are these jobs viable for a good standard of living? Answer – no. Mike is telling you the same you will hear from the Wal-Mart talking heads, what they will do for the aesthetic look that we so desire. No Thanks.
Besides, I don’t care what kind of lipstick you apply, Pittsfield is still at pig.
Since progressives have proven themselves to be incapable of getting good paying jobs in this area, some jobs are better than NO jobs. If progressives had friendlier attitudes toward business they might be able to lure companies to come here, but progressives are all about being anti-business.
Three “progressives” in two sentences. That’s pretty impressive even for you, Pat.
Thank you.
Pat it’s easier to get a pot dispensary approved around here than a Dunkin Donuts.
Any job is better than no job. Would you rather have Walmart move out to the Mall?
Walmart mostly has part time jobs except for the managers. The problem isn’t a Super Walmart. A Super Walmart could easily come to this area (we already have a Walmart) and have a welcome mat rolled out for it if we had an actual economy in this area, but as Dan V. has said so often in the past, Pittsfield doesn’t have an actual economy. North County isn’t any better.
It’s all about tourist resorts and non-profits. All of these do not pay well either, but everybody picks on Walmart. Canyon Ranch and Cranwell are very wealthy resorts, but nobody complains about the fact that they do not pay their workers $15.00 per hour.
Is the real reason for the Walmart store to accommodate the contract for affordable housing at the AH Rice facility?. Please read the real info as to this and many other problems. Mike Ward is not accurate as usual. The Tyler St. project needs the Walmart project to meet federal requirements for more and present affordable housing (section 8) from other parts of the state.
PS. Bill D thanks for real data
I am against Walmarts address change…this site is to develope manufacturing.
If they have information in fact nothing will ever be built here say so tell the people paying the price.
Also im for it if they put a fence around morning side
I find Pittsfields situation with developers pretty simple. If you want to continue to spend like a drunken sailor on leave. You must become a whore to development. Yes Walmart, and all who want to build here. Can’t have it both ways. Most build tax base to feed habit.
Joe you nailed it….Instead of Tyer adding 6 million dollars to the budget she should have cut 5 million from the schools….an 11 million dollar turn around…..she is head peter principle ….she like kroll amuso mazzeo Caccamo white connell are elected to jobs they can not do..was Bouvier in the eagle today…she now shows up at fires….she has not brought 1 job to pittsfield
Bouvier values Lenox Ma…Bouvier is afraid of people from pittsfield….Bouvier said Taconic was a job magnet…this is the dumbest thing but pols say it because it kicks the can df own the road….lets be honest…lenox need s jobs for kids there but they are unlikely to come
Bouvier is an untalented hack. She has done nothing in the legislature to help Pittsfield. I dont count hte bones and crumbs Leadership lets her have for ALWAYS voting how the bosses tell her. She is probably the weakest most illprepared bum in the entire state house…and thats saying a lot.
Go Mike bloomberg!!!!!
The truth is that this area and the country are beyond the ability of any politician to “save us”. It’s going to be up to the people, all of us, coming together and agreeing on what we stand for and what we value and pursuing those goals. No politicians, regardless of their party, can do that for us. Bigger government isn’t the answer. Politicians don’t have the answers.
We the people have to take back our country from all of these clueless politicians. We still need some politicians obviously, or I should say unfortunately, but we need to stop giving them “godlike” qualities. We will just be let down time after time.
Jobs are the answer.Conservatives dont want to build anything.Progressive s will start building bridges tomorrow and you will stop them.
The former Mayor stated someone would get their palms greased with this project, wonder whom?
Trump will not be able to pass a jobs bill .
I would vote yes if PEDA would come right out and say that is the best we can get. Say that multiple manufacturers declined any offers to locate there. The super Wal-Mart in Pittsfield may hurt the North Adams one. People that travel from Pittsfield now,won’t have to do that.
I have lots of friends and relatives in North Adams so I go to the super Walmart in that area whenever I visit them which is often. A Pittsfield Super Walmart will get shoppers from the South County area. Yes, even the rich shop at Walmart. They go in disguise since they pretend they would never shop there.
Cory Thurston says in this month’s Berkshire Trade and Commerce:
“There are great sites within the…business park that are ready for industrial development but the teens isn’t one of them. It may be the largest individual parcel in the park but it’s also the most complicated and problematic. If there were another proponent with a proposal we would certainly consider it. But the cost and amount of work that has to be done to the site is not something that most potential industrial users would be willing to take on. Waterstone is willing to make that investment now, at no cost to the city and taxpayers. We may not have that opportunity again.”
I pretty much think that means PEDA is saying it’s the best we can get….
What happens when Countries like China offer even more to U S defector Companies and lower prices even more, Trunp?
I say build Walmart at the PEDA site. The city could then stop building Taconic and move it to the old Walmart and Coventa site. We will teach the kids how to recycle while giving them a cheaper school. The school will even be able to have movable walls and open classrooms!
Oops, previously posted this on yesterday’s comments by mistake.
Totally agree with Mike’s idea, if it ends up going through. I think the council should make it a deal breaker. Sure wish Mike was still a member.
I would also have them sign an agreement, as unbreakable as the consent decree, stating that they will never seek a tax break and that all of the other development they speak of will be completed before they get an occupancy permit. We need to show some spine here and be in the driver seat for once. I’m sick of all the business’ threatening to leave without TIFs etc. Wally wants that site badly or they wouldn’t keep coming back to it. We should use that to our advantage for once!
But before I could say yes or no, I’d like to hear exactly how they intent to remediate the site. My guess is that they will bury the slabs and cap the entire site, just like hill 78 and Silver Lake.
Leaving PCBs in place is not acceptable. They must remove them, so the land can be repurposed when they eventually leave. Has anyone seen exactly what they say they will do? Maybe the board of health can bless it at the same time they allow Wally to sell cigs? Isn’t it crazy that a little mom and pop store with maybe 50-100 sales per day loses their license, yet a massive commercial complex that will sell thousands of cartons at discounts, will be allowed to become the tobacco king of the PITTS? Nice plan.
Speaking of plans, could the PEDA folks provide us with a map of all the other wonderful building sites? My recollection is that many of the buildings along East St. we’re simply knocked down and buried or covered. The terrain there does not look development friendly.
The name of the Wal-Mart is going to be Mike’s Wal-Mart or Springside East Winds at Wal- Mart Bridge.
How bout Planet Valenti Walmart at East Street Bridge?
They were. Just look at that high up parking lot they will not use. Just past the lake. There’s a building under there.
Do Wal Marts sell gasoline?
So 3 weeks after the bridge open we have a super strip mall proposed…….answer is No
It’s clear no W M and I’m writing in Heller.
Thank you Planet for the great blog!